Tuesday, August 16, 2011

And the witch hunt ends

Wow...a major infraction from a forum I'm leaving. Someone remind me to cry at a later date.

"...bringing the nature of a private discussion into a public thread without the permission of the other participant." So, I got hurt...said I got hurt...tried desperately not to point fingers...rushed as best as possible to see that fingers couldn't be pointed...she makes it clear that it was her of whom I spoke...and *I* brought the nature of the private conversation into the open?

Well, perspective is everything, and I could very well be incredibly wrong about it. I would ask that a mod point out exactly where I revealed the nature of our conversation, but I'll get to that later.

"At this time, the Rules of Posting do not include specific penalties for harassment/stalking, such as sending PMs to another poster after they have specifically asked that one stop, or for so-called 'cyberbullying,' wherein a poster uses their community influence to attack, belittle, or otherwise ostracize a given user. If we did, you would be receiving a separate infraction for that as well." Well, I pushed for an alternative form of contact because GitP limits the amount of messaging, and thought Facebook would give us more room to chat. Wanting phone calls...? Well, I was hoping to build to that point, to help her gain strength. I don't recall pushing that hard, but...

...well, I made a terrible mistake. You see, when I realized Psycho Lass was so over the edge that no amount of help from me would help her regain an ounce of strength, I ceased contact and deleted all of the messages between us. All I remember is trying to get through her Wall of Crazy to talk to the human being cowering inside her. But as has been said, "There is no Dana, only Zuul." Or something like that. Again, sorry I tried to help.

"...the 'rules' in the first post cannot supersede the forum rules, which indicate that anyone may post on any thread so long as they stay on general topic. No one can 'own' a thread nor proscribe how it is used except for the moderation staff." It's almost as though no one read what I wrote when I edited the first post of the Depression thread. I said, "It was pure ego, I think, to create a bunch of rules that no one followed anyway. (Really...imagine me thinking that I could be the voice of reason here.) So...Just follow the Forum Rules, and good luck." Perhaps I was still too kind with that. Perhaps it should have read, "Suicide implements are available for the asking. Fight the trolls or kill yourselves. It doesn't matter to me. See ya, bitches." But, no...that would be the voice of my evil twin, and we try not to let him see the light of day.

All of the quotes from that PM were in red text, which is meant to be quite serious. But then Rich Burlew just had to take a personal hand in things to...I dunno...make me feel better? More depressed? Bring my diabetes into a state of even worse control? "On a more candid note, I would point out that more than one of my moderators suggested your immediate banning, on the grounds that harassment is a criminal offense in most jurisdictions." I don't recall harassing a soul. When I realized I was pressing Psycho Lass too hard to act something like a human being, I back away so far as to say I was leaving the Playground. I'd been hurt for the last time. The last of many. And now I need to send messages elsewhere to find out if any of my supposed friends are the ones who were willing to vote for my banning.

And Rich...if you ever happen to see this. Your "personal touch" was completely unnecessary. I don't need to know what plans you have in the future for your web site. I certainly don't need to carry the blame for whatever it is you do. And I pray my name and this incident don't EVER get mentioned openly as to why you start changing policy. You've done more than enough harm to me with your "personal touch."

And, yes...this is all about me. Because I really have stopped giving a damn about how others feel. No one really seemed to give a damn how I felt, which was really, really "special" for me.

I'm going to take care of some more on,line business, take more insulin to try and keep myself out of the hospital, and then TRY to rest.


"Blue" said...

I have been on the recieving end of true cyberbullying and true harassment. You know. I've spoken to you about "him". I think the many years of it put me in such a position that I can actually spot a manipulator a mile away. And I can say that that psycho girl does ring far too many red bells.

1) She uses ANGRY tone towards you in private. Angry, accusing, harsh.

2) While she's doing #1, she's using, in the public eye, a VICTIM tone. MAJOR red flag here! Using an accusing tone in private while at the same exact time using an "Oh noes, I'm a terrible burden and a poor innocent victim" tone in public SCREAMS of intentional manipulation.

3) How exactly was she "ostratized", anyways? I read the DT, and only I and one other person expressed anger or any other such negative feelings towards her and/or her actions. Most people in there hardly paid attention, or at least they didn't get involved in it! When you posted on the Goodbye thread, I saw no demonizing of the little woman. I saw sadness at your leaving. That she would even CLAIM to having been "ostratized" screams of manipulation. It's the manipulator's way: cause a reaction, then twist it and turn it into an "attack" on their poor innocent selves (OH GODS HOW OFTEN "HE" DID THAT. How could I not recognize the pattern, having lived through it so long!)

And while she claims you're the one "bullying" her and "ostratizing" her, she has singlehandedly convinced the mods (Who has HIGHER standing in the community, anyways?) that you're the one at fault, that you're some kind of criminal they should have insta-banned. They singled out YOUR actions (as viewed through the twisted lens of a manipulator) in an ANNOUNCEMENT. Who is the one ostratized here?! I have to wonder if she recieved similar infractions/warnings. Because while I see you making several well-intentioned mistakes, I only see ONE person harassing and truly trying to turn people against the other. And it's NOT you.

Gods, this makes me so ANGRY! To see a manipulator not too unlike "him" that tormented me for years get away with it... AUGH!

Anonymous said...

The mods itp have gotten ridiculous, and the Giant is a dick. You'll be missed, Bor, but I don't blame you one bit for leaving after this mess. You probably don't want them, but *hugs*.

arguskos said...

Well damn. My respect for that staff has dropped a notch. I do hope, dearly, that you are not the only person who was wailed on by the staff, but somehow I doubt it.

I feel like the real shame is that projects like the DT are now disallowed because of a single incident. There's being vigilant moderators and then there's being overly restrictive.

I'm sorry to see your legacy be destroyed like this, Rob.

Anonymous said...

The GitP moderation staff has no idea how to maintain a safe and peaceful board. It's akin to the low crime rate in, for example, Soviet Russia. It's sad and depressing and she was being manipulative and had the pattern lasted longer, abusive.

I will not say that you preformed admirably (because I think we both know you didn't), but you were not criminal and while a major infraction for trolling may have been in order, threat of legal action is... a threat.

"Blue" said...

You know one thing that angers me? That the staff, which is supposed to be impartial, I think they went down harshly of Bor JUST because he's older. As though younger people can only be victims. Hell no, that's not the case. The abuse I went through? It was done by a younger person. Younger people can and DO take advantage of older people if they see any vulnerability. And manipulative people like this are EXPERTS at seeing vulnerability.

I am furious right now at the conglomerated staff. This is disgusting.

Anonymous said...

When I first heard of this situation I was so very upset. I was recently banned and although I may or may not have deserved it, I do believe that site moderation is rather inconsistent. It kind of skims an arbitrary line between vigilant and negligent and at it's best is large penalty from something viewed out of context.

Zeb The Troll said...

"The mods itp have gotten ridiculous"

"My respect for that staff has dropped a notch."

"The GitP moderation staff has no idea how to maintain a safe and peaceful board. It's akin to [...] Soviet Russia."

"I am furious right now at the conglomerated staff. This is disgusting."

You guys know that I read this, right? I mean, it's not like he has posts with my name in them or anything.

I would just like to remind everyone here commenting that there are exactly three people that know the full extent of what happened between these two, and that not a single one of the NINE moderators is among them.

Furthermore, not a single one of you has the full story either. Not about what was said privately between the two nor about what was said by The Staff about what was going on.

If you want to be upset that this (among other things) has caused Rob to leave, if you want to be upset that the Depression Thread is gone, that's fair. Don't go blaming a dozen people for what was ultimately one person's decision and, if you decide to judge that person or his decision, at least acknowledge that you're making that judgment without all of the information either.

"threat of legal action is... a threat."

I think you misinterpreted something that was said. There was no threat of legal action, subtle or overt.

Anonymous said...

Hi Bor,

we never really crossed paths in the forum but a always respected what you did & your gift for compassion.

you will be missed.

Archonic Energy

"Blue" said...


I'm sorry. But I really am mad at the conglomerated staff. Not at any one mod in particular. But at the "Big Footprint" if you will. Take a look at the infraction post. They're basically calling Bor a criminal in there. They don't know what happened fully and they still give out an accusation as harsh and serious as that. Call him a harasser. And you know what? I have doubt that had it been, say, me, a 27 year old woman, rather than Bor, a 43 year old man, they wouldn't have been calling me a criminal harasser. Or if it had been someone younger. Someone, say, 14 years old. And, in fact, if the roles had been reversed and the one accusing the other of harassment had been the older one, I also don't think it would have been taken so seriously as it was here.

As I pointed out in my first comment, the girl gives out serious red flags for manipulator. I'm sorry, Zeb, but if you are talking in two places at once about the same subject in two different tones... one is faked. And in cases like this? It's only too likely to be the public tone. Think about it. You're upset, you want support. And what an *easy* thing it is, to act like the victim, how *easy* it is to say "This old man is STALKING me!" and that will very quickly bring about the defensiveness in other people. This CREEPY OLD MAN is stalking this girl! Something must be done! I'm not saying she was not upset. She most likely was. But she DID exaggerate things. I've been on the receiving end of caring Bor. And he does press for being allowed to help. But NEVER, in my experience, to the point where it could be called harassment of all things.

And about the rules... well... indeed, they don't supercede forum rules and I don't think ANYONE was ever under that impression. But they were guidelines for considerate behaviour. I mean, seriously. Imagine that I go in there and say "You know what. I'm going to harm myself." and then I get offended if someone PMs me for help. I mean, seriously. It's a thread that was dedicated to help people. It's a slap to the face if you don't go there at least with the intention of getting help. Sure, you can just vent, but seriously you have to at least expect someone is going to TRY to help, especially for something so serious. That's why I stopped posting in the DT for the most part. Because I knew that there was no help I could get there and posting about my chronic desires (and even attempts) to hurt myself when no one would be able to help was EXTREMELY inconsiderate of me. It would just make them feel bad to be unable to help and just watch. So a reply of "Go away, I don't want help" is an extremely inconsiderate remark for someone who bothered posting in a thread specifically created to give and recieve help.

"Blue" said...

Zeb: (part 2, wow, that was long)

But you know what bothers me most and why I said I find it "disgusting" that such a harsh decision was smacked down on Bor while the other person was viewed as the victim? It's the whole thing with the older person so easily seen as the perpetrator of a crime, rather than the victim, especially when a much younger person is involved. I have VERY strong feelings about this. You probably read that I mentioned "HIM" in the first comment. Thing is, Zeb, I used to have a friend. And this guy... well... he seemed to really care and all, and he was the first friend I ever had that raelly seemed to care and at my 20 years of age or so back then, I was under such a depression that I quickly fell for this guy's charms. Not in a romantic way. But he was like a little brother and all I wanted was to please him. He was 6 years younger than I. And, it turns out, the "dominant" one. He very sneakily placed me into such a position that if I didn't do what he wanted, he would threaten me with the loss of his friendship. And, well, to a chronically depressed person, this was... impossible. Using EVERY marker of an abusive relationship (even though this was a friendship), he kept me in misery for YEARS. Through abuse, manipulation, blame-shifting. Yes. A YOUNGER person took advantage of me. And you know who was given the blame? I was. Because I was older. And seeing, for example, Bor take the blame for "revealing" the PM when it was she that did that (and in plain view!), well... seeing this kind of thing makes me SO mad.

I'm not saying "I'm right, you're wrong, go away" but I am elaborating as to why I disagree on the Big Footprint's decision. And why I find it so... ugh.

Please, Zeb, don't feel like I singling you out or something. At least from what I have seen around here, you seem like a very reasonable guy. But honestly... that infraction message... really pushes far too many buttons for me. And it is the "consensus of the staff" in theory, even if in practice it's probably "What Rich says after listening to the input of his staff".

... I guess it would probably be a lot more accurate to say "I'm REALLY mad at Rich and the moderators that fell into the "he's older, therefore CREEPY STALKER" trap".

(I hope that I didn't eat anything from the post!)

arguskos said...

Zeb, fair enough. When the Footprint gets involved, I tend to believe that it means the entire staff is involved. I'll take you at your word that such isn't the case, since you've always been an upstanding individual in our interactions.

I still disagree with some of what I've seen here, specifically the removal of the DT, and will happily admit I lack 100% of the story, but you are correct, I should not be angry at the entire moderation staff and I apologize for it.

The Scrabbler said...

I have no criticism for you, Zeb, nor any of the other Mods. I have very little understanding of the situation, and I'll try not to judge.

That being said, I've just left the Playground. I have no illusions that my departure will matter to more than two playgrounders, but I simply have no reason to remain. For over a year now, my main reason for going on the playground was for the DT. Sometimes I needed help, sometimes I wanted to help others. With the DT gone, GitP has nothing to offer me except a reminder of the great resource that used to be available, but was denied to everyone due to one situation. I've posted on the goodbye thread, providing my blog and email information on the offchance that anyone cares.

-Lord of Kobolds
Evan Juers